11/16/2014 - GitHub: Now what?

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11/16/2014 - GitHub: Now what?

PostPosted by Railboy » Sun Nov 16, 2014 9:46 pm

Alright, here it is. I've chosen GitHub and set up a profile, an organization and a public Repository under the GPL 3.0 license. This is where FRONTIERS' code is going to be made available for modders and enthusiasts.

https://github.com/AADProductions/FRONTIERS

Now what? Organizing this is... daunting.

First off, I won't be uploading the entire project to GitHub because there are third-party libraries that I can't redistribute (yet). Instead I'll be uploading the pieces that I know for sure are free and clear. Over time I'll add dependencies as I secure permission from the authors.

That means people won't be able to compile something that, you know, runs. They won't even be able to supply the missing dependencies from a third party because in most cases I've modified the middleware I'm using. They'll just be able to look at pieces. Does this break some kind of GitHub code? Are repositories for projects expected to be complete? I dunno.

Then there's the problem of how to incorporate other people's changes back into the main project. (I'm assuming someone, somewhere may actually want to change something.)

Right now I've got a local project. I edit that, then commit my changes to a remote SVN repository. Given that setup, what to do if someone out there sees fit to commit a change to GitHub, and I see fit to incorporate that change into my local project? Is it even possible to mix and match two svn repositories at once? If not, what happens if I slip up and don't commit my local changes to GitHub for a week and that person has now altered an outdated version of a class?

*Mind boggles*

Alright. Well. I've created the repository. First step: complete.
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Re: 11/16/2014 - GitHub: Now what?

PostPosted by Faw » Mon Nov 17, 2014 2:52 pm

Just using the mechanisms that git and maybe github provides should solve your contributions problem. Google pull requests for merging contributions. However if you plan to incorporate user contributions into the main game, you'll have to add clauses/ToSs that specify contributors giving up their rights to their contributions. Otherwise you end up with a result where you can't be sure (legally speaking) who owns what percentage of what. At least that seems to be the case.

Otherwise, good job! Very community oritented, which I like. Wonder what it'll be like later to add mods.
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Re: 11/16/2014 - GitHub: Now what?

PostPosted by SignpostMarv » Wed Nov 19, 2014 7:12 pm

You're mentioning 3 different repo types there; cvs, svn & git- are you using git locally & just flubbing terms ? 'tis needed to ask since there are actually tools to transpose between git and svn etc.

Anywoo, regarding "what if someone makes a change", give me a few seconds minutes and you'll see what happens see this pull request.

The tabs in the pull request interface let you see what changes & the diff of changes etc. GitHub can merge the change in for you, then you just pull down from github using whatever client you're using :)
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Re: 11/16/2014 - GitHub: Now what?

PostPosted by Railboy » Wed Nov 19, 2014 7:50 pm

SignpostMarv wrote:You're mentioning 3 different repo types there; cvs, svn & git- are you using git locally & just flubbing terms ? 'tis needed to ask since there are actually tools to transpose between git and svn etc.


Whoops, I swap the svn and cvs acronyms all the time, but in every case you can bet I mean svn because I've never actually used cvs before. (And yup you're right I did it in my post, fixing that now.)

As for git - never used it until last week and I have only the dimmest notions of what it's doing under the hood, or how it differs from svn. (For that reason I'm also not clear on what it's doing when it transposes between git and svn, or how that link is supposed to be set up.) I've temporarily avoided the whole issue by treating the GitHub repository as a totally separate project from my main project.

I'm looking into pull requests now, hopefully that'll help me wrap my head around some of this. Thanks for the demo.

(I can't wait until the day I can hire someone to be the git master and just not have to worry about any of this stuff... next to paying taxes it's probably my least favorite part of the development process.)
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Re: 11/16/2014 - GitHub: Now what?

PostPosted by SignpostMarv » Wed Nov 19, 2014 7:58 pm

Railboy wrote:As for git - never used it until last week and I have only the dimmest notions of what it's doing under the hood, or how it differs from svn. (For that reason I'm also not clear on what it's doing when it transposes between git and svn, or how that link is supposed to be set up.) I've temporarily avoided the whole issue by treating the GitHub repository as a totally separate project from my main project.


Perhaps this might help? GitHub: Support for Subversion clients

Railboy wrote:(I can't wait until the day I can hire someone to be the git master and just not have to worry about any of this stuff... next to paying taxes it's probably my least favorite part of the development process.)


/me coughs
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Re: 11/16/2014 - GitHub: Now what?

PostPosted by Merla » Thu Nov 20, 2014 12:44 am

Railboy wrote:Alright, here it is. I've chosen GitHub and set up a profile, an organization and a public Repository under the GPL 3.0 license.


I'm not an expert in this, but are you sure, GPL 3 is the right license for this? http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.htm ... AllowMoney

If I understood correctly, you want to release everything you can of the assets and code, if possible for you. But combined with GPL this would mean, that anyone could put Frontiers to their site (eg. a store) and sell it without paying you anything. I think a license which allows to use PARTS of Frontiers for other works, but doesn't allow to redistribute and sell as the complete game, would be helpful ?!

And maybe these slides give you an idea about git: http://slideshare.net/carlbrown/introdu ... d-concepts

Faw wrote:However if you plan to incorporate user contributions into the main game, you'll have to add clauses/ToSs that specify contributors giving up their rights to their contributions.

Yep! If you later would like to change the license, this could get you into trouble, eg. you make a Frontiers 2 and reuse the code base of Frontiers, but doesn't want to release this as opensource, you would want to have the code in an different license as GPL because this would be a derivative work. Derivative works needs to be releases under GPL if they incorporate GPL-licensed work.

I can not guarantee that this is all correct, but this is my understanding of the licensing. Probably this could help: http://choosealicense.com/
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Re: 11/16/2014 - GitHub: Now what?

PostPosted by Railboy » Thu Nov 20, 2014 1:22 am

Merla wrote:
Railboy wrote:Alright, here it is. I've chosen GitHub and set up a profile, an organization and a public Repository under the GPL 3.0 license.


I'm not an expert in this, but are you sure, GPL 3 is the right license for this? http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.htm ... AllowMoney

If I understood correctly, you want to release everything you can of the assets and code, if possible for you. But combined with GPL this would mean, that anyone could put Frontiers to their site (eg. a store) and sell it without paying you anything. I think a license which allows to use PARTS of Frontiers for other works, but doesn't allow to redistribute and sell as the complete game, would be helpful ?!


I get why you're concerned but here's a couple of things to keep in mind. First, I won't be able to include all of the art assets (or even a majority of the art assets) because they're modified versions of third party assets. Second, I won't be including any of the written bits - missions, dialog, books, etc. - in this project. Those will be made available separately, with a separate license. The stuff that won't be included adds up to a major part of the game, so I'm not in danger of anyone legally redistributing anything resembling the complete game.

However if an industrious modder starts with the bits I've released and manages to turn it into a complete project on their own, then hell yes they can sell it. That would be impressive.

And the fact that this forces me to keep future derivative works open source is deliberate as well. If anything sustains this project in the long term it'll be modding, and keeping the code base fresh can only help that. If I rewrite a FRONTIERS system to be better then modders should have access to those changes.
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Re: 11/16/2014 - GitHub: Now what?

PostPosted by Faw » Thu Nov 20, 2014 6:32 pm

Railboy wrote:...
And the fact that this forces me to keep future derivative works open source is deliberate as well. If anything sustains this project in the long term it'll be modding, and keeping the code base fresh can only help that. If I rewrite a FRONTIERS system to be better then modders should have access to those changes.


Awesome. This stance of yours alone makes me glad I backed you. A project is only ever as alive as its community. Give and they'll give back.
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Re: 11/16/2014 - GitHub: Now what?

PostPosted by blitzfisch » Sun Jul 19, 2015 2:27 am

Faw wrote:
Railboy wrote:...
And the fact that this forces me to keep future derivative works open source is deliberate as well. If anything sustains this project in the long term it'll be modding, and keeping the code base fresh can only help that. If I rewrite a FRONTIERS system to be better then modders should have access to those changes.


Awesome. This stance of yours alone makes me glad I backed you. A project is only ever as alive as its community. Give and they'll give back.

+1 awesome. Good to see this on github. Giving back to the community is a great thing to do.
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