3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

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3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by Railboy » Wed Mar 26, 2014 3:30 pm

I thought it was an April Fool's joke at first, but the statements from Facebook and Oculus confirmed that it was real. Oculus has been bought by Facebook for a staggering TWO BILLION dollars. Facebook. Oculus. Two billion. Say it with me:
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Notch already did a great job of explaining his problem with this arrangement. Facebook is a bad company that doesn't care about people. If something has their logo on it I'm not sticking it anywhere near my face. Believe it or not, this choice isn't the result of a principled stand - it stems from a deep-seated feeling of unease, like spotting a hideous spider off my hand and shaking it off in disgust. I simply don't like Mark and his company. They make me feel queasy. The thought of them pumping ads into my VR experience or eavesdropping and selling what they glean to third parties - or even just gently guiding the research towards areas that serve their interests - makes me feel queasy. And don't think for a second they won't stoop to that level. Maybe not right away, but eventually their fingerprints will be all over this.

Oh, Oculus. I completely understand why you did it - you can get a lot done with two billion dollars. But I wish you'd gone the Tesla route and stayed independent. I won't be ordering the second devkit and I strongly doubt I'll be ordering the final product. I now place my hope and trust in Valve (or maybe Sony) to create the ultimate VR experience.

What does this mean for FRONTIERS? Very little. I promised to support the Oculus in the campaign, so I will. End of story.

What does this mean for VR? Well, I certainly don't think it's a disaster, even though I personally feel dismayed. Facebook might be a slimy company but they're not going to run Oculus into the ground. Also, if VR was a secret sauce known only by a privileged few or if the hardware wasn't mostly off-the-shelf then maybe I'd be worried about the long-term future of VR, but the genie was out of the bottle months ago. It's just a matter of time before we see strong competitors emerge. Oculus did the hard part by popularizing the idea and creating a prototype and for that I'm thankful to them. And of course this deal WILL push VR forward by enabling Oculus to deliver a bona fide final product very quickly. Even if I personally want little to do with it.

Sad day.

[edit] Look at the reactions on the Oculus post. Strongly negative. I'm sure Oculus is unhappy about those comments, but they're letting them stay there. Now look at all the glowing and positive comments on Mark's post. That's because all the negative comments are being quickly swept away. Facebook also appears to be sending out shills to post positive comments on reddit. This kind of thing may seem trivial, but to me it's a perfect demonstration of why they make me feel queasy.
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Re: 3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by HammelGammel » Wed Mar 26, 2014 4:02 pm

I don't even know what to say really... those are bad news. I was so looking forward to buying an oculus, but no more. This is indeed a sad day.
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Re: 3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by antihuman09 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 5:21 pm

Fuuuuuuuck.

:shock:
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Re: 3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by Mark Shaun Rushow » Wed Mar 26, 2014 5:37 pm

One of the great thing about the Rift is all the research and feedback that has gone into the development of the Rift from so many developers and fans. This was the great strength of it. I woke up yesterday to the Sony announcement of Project Morpheus and was dismayed my that thinking Sony would steal all of the Rifts thunder before they ever got to market and probably push an inferior product too boot plus they have way more money. I felt life the Rift had a good chance of getting cheated. Then later in the evening I find out about the Facebook deal and I just went nuclear. I had such hope for the Rift and I'm sure it'll still be a great maybe the best at first VR experience but Facebook is a terrible company and will only hurt the Rift in the long run. So, oddly it may be Sony that saves the day for me. I can only hope they learn from what the Rift was doing and do it just as well or better. The Sony Prototype so far has a long way to go to catch up. Plus will, Sony put out a free SDK for the dev and will Sony support PC? I highly doubt it. They will focus on the Playstation of course. And I was all in for the first time in my life for PC. I'm half way through a new build in anticipation of the Rift when this news hits. I'm invested in many PC games that are going to support the Rift. I wish the deal would have waited. If Sony is working on VR you can bet Microsoft is going to eventually as well. If Sony is doing there own thing it would have been a good bet Microsoft would eventually try and acquire the Rift and that would have been much better than Facebook. And Microsoft would probably eventually still support PC. If I'd heard a Google deal or Steam that would have been very good news. I haven't heard about the Tesla deal I'll have to look it up. Though there are many working on their own devices the Rift was doing so many things right and has so much dev support and was shooting to be universal and open and ubiquitous as it could be. So much thought has to go into the software, hardware, and SDK to make it so the experience isn't nauseating and the Rift has learned so much I hope Sony can figure it out too.
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Re: 3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by InfinityOne » Thu Mar 27, 2014 2:27 am

The way I see it is that Oculus is now the "sacrificial lamb" that will make mass adoption of VR a reality and not just a "god I hope so". That was Palmer's initial goal after all (not that I agree with his choice of funding). It probably would have happened anyway but still had a better chance to flop without it. Don't get me wrong I really hate Facebook but if VR gets it off the ground now and gets big developers seriously looking at it then good. If facebook keeps its initial promise and doesn't touch CV1 then I still might take the plunge.

Hopefully in 3-5 years the Valve VR tech you described Railboy plus things we haven't heard of or dreamt of yet will be available. Oculus/Facebook might turn into crap by then but the other choices might be amazing. Even though I am sad at this point the future might not be as grim as it looks right now.

...... Or it all goes up in flames :twisted: Only time will tell.
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Re: 3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by yarnevk » Thu Mar 27, 2014 1:36 pm

Sony is not going to figure it out, just look at their decade of lousy 3DTV headsets. Expect nothing more from then than cashing in on an upcoming trend with cheap commodity products that they can make money on before word gets around how much they suck, with them milking it for five years before hyping the next gen. Just look at thier failed console accesories line, eye toy, etc.
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Re: 3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by Mark Shaun Rushow » Fri Mar 28, 2014 4:47 am

I felt the same way when i first heard the Sony announcement. I was actually angry great Sony with all their money will throw together some mile of crap, get it to market first, get all the credit from their fans, and screw over Oculus and all the hard work they did figuring it all out. This still may be the case. So far the Sony concept is using an LED screen and not the mOLED the Rift Dev Kit 2 is using, the field of view is noticeable narrower. Those two things are very important for the sense of immersion. Plus the very fast tracking and high frame rate as well as the method of turning the display off until a new image has arrived from GPU reducing motion blur. There is so much more to consider as well. Now Sony did mention at lot of this stuff so hopefully they rip Oculus off correctly and learn from everything they are doing. What Adam Sessler had to say I have to agree with though. If there are too many different kits and SDks for these things the whole market will be dead in the water before it ever gets started. We need one company like Oculus working with others to figure it all out and set standards. The competition can come later with through improvements. We don't need VR fragmented in too many different ways too early on. So much with the Oculus has gone into the software from all the different devs working with the company. Oculus has always said they would like the Rift to work with anything and there is no reason it can't the consoles manufacturers only need to support it. There is no reason for any one to start making their own proprietary units yet. After I heard about Sony's concept (Project Morpheus) I thought it would be a good idea for Microsoft to come out and announce plans to support the Rift. That would have been a genius move and they wouldn't have to try and figure it all out themselves. We know Valve is behind the Rift and working closely with them, sharing research into VR. Sony really should change their mind and wait and see what all can be learned from Oculus and let them introduce the world to the first units. Just support it. Then improve, I mean they are Sony they make hardware they can try and improve upon it later or in the background after everyone gets a taste and we know VR is here to stay. Right now it looks like things are going to very confusing for gamers that aren't in the know. And if Sony puts out some crap that makes people sick and or breaks the sense of immersion it could ruin the idea of VR for many many people. Plus think of the devs. We need them to support VR and too many units out there makes it really hard to decide to do so.
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Re: 3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by jam » Sun Mar 30, 2014 4:51 am

How are you going to give us proper Oculus support if you don't at least have dk2 with proper head tracking? Are you going to borrow a friends? in any case since Facebook doesn't control Oculus completely (for the moment) I think it's honestly a little childish that you refuse to get one because of a deal that won't effect you yet, they have been acquired it's to late to vote with your wallet, and yes i think notch was even more childish then that, he could of silently cancelled a mod he never even started, but instead felt the need to let the rest of the world know he was upset.

sorry if this post comes across as rude but it's how I and I'm sure many others feel.
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Re: 3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by Tommo » Sun Mar 30, 2014 4:54 am

I'm taking a more sit back and wait approach. If Facebook screws us over well to be honest it's what i expect, if not and they release a product and it's not completely destroyed, well hooray for VR. Also one thing, John Carmack now works for Oculus and when you're as influential as Carmack if he doesn't wanna do something he can really just walk away. So as soon as I see the headline "John Carmack has left Oculus" then I shall know that Facebook has done wrong.
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Re: 3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by RyanASpan » Sun Mar 30, 2014 5:13 am

jam wrote:How are you going to give us proper Oculus support if you don't at least have dk2 with proper head tracking? Are you going to borrow a friends?

How are you making these assumptions from a post by Lars which says he'll provide full support as promised, and doesn't even mention DK2?
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Re: 3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by Tommo » Sun Mar 30, 2014 5:26 am

I think what Jam is getting at is that Lars says he is going to support the oculus but he is wondering how if he doesn't have a dev kit 2 or final version to test on.
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Re: 3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by RyanASpan » Sun Mar 30, 2014 7:51 am

Tommo wrote:I think what Jam is getting at is that Lars says he is going to support the oculus but he is wondering how if he doesn't have a dev kit 2 or final version to test on.

That's my point. Kind of a big leap to the conclusion that Lars will never have a Dev Kit 2. He pledged to support the Rift during the Kickstarter campaign, which is a promise one does not simply go back on; not to mention that Lars is a stand-up guy who has been nothing but honest with our backers even when it didn't make us look good. Knowing him, he'll do whatever is necessary to keep that promise.
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Re: 3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by Railboy » Sun Mar 30, 2014 8:41 am

TL;DR - whatever-it-is I have to do to fully support the Rift, that's what I'll do. It's too early to say exactly what that is yet.

Ugh. How sad is it that this is now the kind of conversation we're having about Rift support? It was supposed to be a joyous thing, not a cold assessment of how and when compromises will have to be made in order to live up to prior obligations.
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Re: 3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by jam » Sun Mar 30, 2014 11:17 am

RyanASpan wrote:
Tommo wrote:I think what Jam is getting at is that Lars says he is going to support the oculus but he is wondering how if he doesn't have a dev kit 2 or final version to test on.

That's my point. Kind of a big leap to the conclusion that Lars will never have a Dev Kit 2. He pledged to support the Rift during the Kickstarter campaign, which is a promise one does not simply go back on; not to mention that Lars is a stand-up guy who has been nothing but honest with our backers even when it didn't make us look good. Knowing him, he'll do whatever is necessary to keep that promise.


what through me off was this line
Railboy wrote: I won't be ordering the second devkit and I strongly doubt I'll be ordering the final product.
sorry if i interpreted it wrong.

and sorry Lars, ive only perpetuated these talks
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Re: 3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by Tommo » Sun Mar 30, 2014 11:22 am

Hey at the very least, we can use some simulated goats to cheer us up from the Oculus news!
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Re: 3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by anemation » Sun Mar 30, 2014 3:18 pm

Pewds did a video on the goat simulator yesterday.
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Re: 3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by RyanASpan » Sun Mar 30, 2014 4:26 pm

jam wrote:what through me off was this line
Railboy wrote: I won't be ordering the second devkit and I strongly doubt I'll be ordering the final product.
sorry if i interpreted it wrong.

...Okay, I totally missed that sentence somehow. My bad.

But yeah, what Lars said. Whatever is necessary will be done.
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Re: 3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by antihuman09 » Sun Mar 30, 2014 4:41 pm

I knew there was a good reason I loved Notch.
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Re: 3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by F-Man » Sun Mar 30, 2014 6:18 pm

Railboy wrote:Look at the reactions on the Oculus post. Strongly negative. I'm sure Oculus is unhappy about those comments, but they're letting them stay there.


Looks like they've deleted the comments.
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Re: 3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by Railboy » Sun Mar 30, 2014 6:30 pm

F-Man wrote:
Railboy wrote:Look at the reactions on the Oculus post. Strongly negative. I'm sure Oculus is unhappy about those comments, but they're letting them stay there.


Looks like they've deleted the comments.

Hmm, the top three comments when I view the page are still 'DO NOT WANT,' 'Not happy about this at all,' and 'No longer interested in Oculus.' Maybe your FB is malfunctioning?

jam wrote:and sorry Lars, ive only perpetuated these talks

No no, I wasn't trying to shut anything down. A discussion has to happen. I'm just saying that it's a bummer.
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Re: 3/26/2014 - Oculus & Facebook

PostPosted by HittingSingularity » Mon Mar 31, 2014 1:10 am

My biggest hope for VR now rests with Valve. It will be interesting to see how closely they continue working with Oculus after this, or how soon they start openly developing their own commercial hardware for VR.

I really think that the only bad thing that can come from this move in the long run is if competing companies start patenting technologies that they 'discover' for VR making other companies find different ways of doing something that won't be as optimal. I honestly hope to God that this isn't even possible, but considering the state of businesses and patents in today's society I kind of doubt it won't happen. ****! :evil:
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